Encore CS3 Menu problem

Are those Static or Motion menus?

Also, when you say they are set to hold for 15 seconds, do you mean the DURATION is 15 seconds? Can you type the actual time value you have in that box (i.e. 00;00;15;00)

Regards,
George

Static menus, George, and yes they are designed for a Duration of 15 seconds and entered as per your example. I am just about to open a new project and redo it. Might just be a quirky file causing this problem. Thanks for your attention.

Harry

Created a new project and still no luck. Anyone any ideas?

Harry :(

Harry,
I've been trying to reproduce your project on my new Encore CS3 (I've done a lot with 2.0 but not much with the new version) and if you wouldn't mind I had a couple of questions.

1. Is there some reason, you want to go from Main menu to Menu 1 as an end action of the Main menu rather than just use the "Scene Select " button?

2. What is the end -action of the Menu 1? Maybe I mis read, but when I recreate it, the Menu1 just stops, since there doesn't appear to be an end action.

3. Where do the other Menus's (2,3,4) fit in? Are they to be accessed in sequence from Menu 1 to give additional buttons for chapter links? ie is the end action of Menu1 , Menu2, etc?

I assume you are using a DVD and not BluRay preset (I've been having general shut down problems with BluRay for some reason, so I'm not using it until I get that figured out).
Once I understand how the project is to work, I'll burn an DVD Image, and burn to disk using ImgBurn and see what happens.
I will say, in the past, I've burned a "folder" and burned it to disk using Nero 6.0 and that always worked well as well.
If you haven't solved it, and you want me to give it a try, let me know.

John Rich

Hi John

I have used Encore CS3 for a a few weeks now and other projects have worked OK. This project has 20 tracks and each track (song) is a Chapter Point. It is in 16:9 format and to save clutter there are 5 Chapter Points on each Menu (Menus 1 - 4). The Main Menu has two choices Play All (linked to the AVI file) or Select a Scene which is linked to Menu 1. The Main Menu end action is linked to Menu 1 and has a duration of 15 Sec's. Menu 1 End Action is linked to Menu 2 etc. with a duration of 20 Sec's. Menu 4 end action is to play the DVD. The idea behind this is if the DVD is left to play it will cycle through the menus and then start to play. There are Back and Next buttons on each of the Menu's 1 - 4.

BTW it is DVD project not a BluRay one (don't want to complicate it any more than it is). I am now going to create an identical project in Encore 1.5 using the same menus and if this works then there must be some problem with CS3.

Thanks for your interest John and will let you know how things go.

Harry

Created a new project in Encore 1.5 and it worked a treat. Imported it into Encore CS3 and burned a DVD also worked as it should. Not really solved the original problem but maybe a corrupt file somewhere. Now a happy person.:D

Thanks for the interest shown. John if you carry with your "test" let me know how it turns out.

Harry

Pleased you sorted it Harry.
I've been following the thread, but couldn't offer constructive advice - as everything seemed correct.
Atleast you now know it's the software that's faulty, not your brain.;)

Harry,

I put your idea together on my system (neat idea) with Encore CS3 using xp sp2 and I had the exact experience you did. It played properly in the "Prieview", but when I burned it to a disk (.iso) image and then used ImgBurn to burn to a disk (DVD+R), for some reason, the timing of the menus's wouldn't work i.e. the menu just sits there.

I'd done a menu system on Encore 2.0 which is similar to the principle of yours and it worked fine when I burned it. It's the one at the bottom of the list here called "Random Menu's". http://jmrser.com/Tutorials.html

I've been discouraged with ENcore CS3, mainly because it just shuts down for no apparent reason. This reminds me of my first experiences with Premiere 6.5. This is just another problem.
Are you going to report this as a bug to Adobe?

Anyway thanks for the idea
John

Hi John

I don't know whether to be sad or glad someone else gets the same problem and therefore it was not me to blame but the software's fault :confused: However, since I can be "retrained" and software problems take longer to solve maybe the answer is sad!

Thanks for the work you have put in to help in this situation. I will report it to Adobe ASAP and when I find out the correct avenue for doing so. I tried your link and was a bit surprised to find that I have it bookmarked and have been using it for some time. So a double thanks.

From your tutorial I notice that your Play All menu is set for the First Play. In my projects I have the Copyright Notice (when appropriate) and about a minute of video as the first play, the End Action being my Play All menu (Main Menu)

Thanks also to Dave for your interest.

Regards

Harry

BTW if you would like I could e-mail you a copy of the Main Menu and Menu 1 and PM me with your snail mail and I will send a copy of the DVD (PAL).

I had a look a Encore CS3, maybe its just me but, it does look a bit complicated, compared to DVDWS2 or DVDLab.

Tony

No its not just you.

Ive just completed my First DVd using Encore CS3. It was fairly simple in theory.

Main Menu Displays first with options to play all and Scene Select. Scene select opens up a sub menu,where you can select one of 6 chapters or go forward to another submenu to select the next 6 chapters or back to the main menu.

Once I sussed out how to use the flowchart and link all the bits together it did seem pretty logical.

However there seems to be a complete lack of literature on encore cs3 .

I got encore when I upgraded my software to Adobe Production Premium CS3

being a complete beginner Ive found the class room in a book series very useful to get to grips with the basics of Premiere Pro and Photoshop. Ive bought the book for After effects as well but havent got round to using it yet. Lets walk first before i try to run.

I'm amazed that there isnt a similar book for Encore or for that matter ANY book on encore CS3.

I saw Encore CS3 on a friends PC. I messed about with it but found it strange, compared to WS2 or DVDLab. Its a bit off putting, well at first glance anyhow.

At the end of the day is it really that much better than WS or DVDLab.

plenty of old tuts here to get you going, http://www.doogs-tutorials.com/ the method is more or less the same with each version..

Thanks Doogs, I'll have a look.

Have both DWS2 and CS3 on my PC and DWS 2 has been left to rust. Would not use it when there is a choice.

Harry

Thanks Harry,

I had a wee go on ECS3 and the main menu duration is giving me a bit of bother, I've it set for 15secs and on the preview screen after 15 secs it starts to play the movie, but the burnt DVD doesn't start playing after the 15sec, just sits there until I hit the play button.

Nothing animated BTW

So were did i go wrong.

I can read minds.
Harry is going to say - 'Wish I knew - I had same problem and rectified by replicating in new project'.

I've no idea, but could try doing a 'file/save' prior to burn.
In general, if you start a new file and try to build dvd prior to first 'save', it prompts (on v2) for you to 'save' first - so I'm not entirely clutching at straws.

Dave, thanks, I'll try that.

Hi Dave

You guessed correctly. I have only had one project that behaved in that manner although John (posted here) had the same problem with my menus which I e-mailed to him. I re-created the project in Encore 1.5 and then opened it in CS3 which solved problem. No doubt it will be back when I have some urgent work to do, so Encore 1.5 stays on my HD.

Harry

Tried saving first before burn and no, it still didn't start after the 15 seconds. I must be doing something wrong.
Another thing I think I saw was a green flash/frame as i watched my footage in the preview window. I also saw a cross type effect that isn't in the original footage.

Tony

Red and Green flashes are nothing new in Encore. There are plenty of other folks suffering the same problem. If you do a couple of searches on here for red+flash and green+flash you'll find them. This is why I've given up on Encore.

As far as i see there not in my finished DVD
Bit of a chance to take all the same not knowing for sure if there going to be in the finished DVD :(

Well, I read the posts about the green/red flash, very interesting. From what I've read they wont be in the finished DVD. One post reported a fix by removing or renaming the "ImporterFastMPEG.prm

I hope you are lucky. When I had the problem I thought it wasn't on the finished DVD until I checked more carefully and found it was. Quite how Adobe are getting away with this I don't know. I'm quite prepared to accept that some people never have a problem but that's no consolation to those of us that do. FWIW I found the flashes occurred when there was a single frame with an area of very high (probably illegal) luma.

Rob, I read that DVD Architect dosent seem to supports the import of m2v files. Is this correct.

Absolutely not! I do it all the time. m2v and PCM or AC3 audio files is exactly the way I go from existing DVDs (with permission of the copyright holders) and from original material from ProCoder etc.

I'm hesitant to say this but I've been using DVDa for some years now and, whilst it isn't perfect, once I learned it it has never let me down. I agree with others who say that it's a pain to make your own buttons but otherwise, it's fine.

As for the flashes, I read those posts as well and, unfortunately, my green ones were persistent and in the final DVDs. The other fix sounds interesting, I'll try it when I have time.

Thanks Rob, so m2v can be imported. Goes to show you cant believe all you read.

Would like to hear about the supposed fix Rob when you get a chance.

Tony

Rob, heres were i read the bit about DVD A.
http://www.videohelp.com/tools/DVD_Architect

"For some reason 4.5 no longer supports the import of m2v files which makes this program useless to me. Very disappointing. I'm sure it is great otherwise as I think the program itself is the best out there but to remove support for m2v's has me miffed. I am going back to 3.0 which is almost exactly the same with m2v support."

Hi Tony,

I've just been playing. I tried REMing the prefs file mentioned above and, sadly, the only difference is that the flashes are now red instead of green.

Also checked which version of DVDa I've been using recently. (I have several versions strewn across four machines.) I can confirm I've been using M2Vs quite happily in DVDa 4.5b Build 59. (I.e. the most recent update I downloaded.) I suppose it is possible there was a problem with the early versions of 4.5 but, if so, definitely resolved now.

Z Cheema is the Vegas/DVDa expert around here but I'm sure he will confirm the same.

So much for that supposed fix and thanks for the info on DVD A

Tony

This encore boy takes a bit of getting used to with end actions etc. Is it worth all the bother :) Easier to get your head round DVDLab, havent used DVD Architect BTW.

Tony

I cannot remember what end actions are like in Encore. In DVDa it's just choose from a drop-down list menu. I've been looking at DVD Lab once again and If I do get fed up with DVDa that is where I think I might go next. That said, with the imminent free upgrade to Blu-ray authoring, it will take a lot to make me jump ship. I have no doubt there will be problems with the first iteration but, given that it's Sony technology, if anyone can get it right it should be them.

Thanks again Rob for your views.

Tony

Following the comments on this thread, I have had another look at DVD Architect. The trial does not import m2v files or burn to DVD, but full marks to Sony for letting me use the trial without asking permission first.

I have just seen Encore burn a DVD. It was faster than DVD WS 2, so wondering if DVD-A is in the same class considering the difference in price.
I am aware of some comments about it being given away free….is it really that bad?

I guess it depends of what you mean by speed of burning. The actual burning process is pretty quick, I'd say approaching the theoretical disk write speed plus a couple of minutes for writing the lead in and lead out.

The preparation time depends of how much re-encoding there is to do. My usual methodology is to use ProCoder to do all the encoding apart from the menu(s) which obviously need to be encoded after they are created. If you choose the correct settings DVD-a will not re-encode the original assets. (E.g. selecting "de-interlace" forces a re-encode. DVDa includes pre-flight tools to help you avoid such problems)

However, you can use a different burning engine to burn from a DVD-a prepare and vice-versa. (Use DVD-a to burn from a disk prepared in something else.) There have been adverse comments about DVD-a's burning ability but it is never made clear whether people are complaining about the actual burn process or the prepare and burn. Either way, I've had no cause for complaint using Pioneer and Sony writers.

I wouldn't judge a product just on price. I'm pretty sure Sony are following the Apple philosophy rather than the Avid/Adobe one. I.e. they want to see lots of people using the products from hobby level up to professional without artificial price differentials. If you want to spend more money you can add the pro version of the Main Concept encoder and an AC-3 encoder. If you are happy with the ones you have you don't need to spend the money. The main reason I bought Adobe CS2 was to get After Effects and, as a bonus, Encore. After Effects is difficult for a non-artist but does the business. Encore on the other hand, despite the integration with Photoshop etc. falls at the first hurdle. I.e. you cannot trust it not to screw up the output. I had thought this only applied with ProCoder encoded files. I've discovered recently that it can do the same thing with other encoders, even its own.

Thanks Rob. I think you have answered some of my unanswered questions. I too have ProCoder, and wish to import the m2v files into the program. Looking at the spec. DVD-A won`t re-code these, and will produce a DVD with AC3 audio. The trial I have is version 3. I think 4.5 is just under £50. Cheaper than WS 2 when I bought it-hence the question.

I didn't realise you could buy DVD Architect without Vegas? If it's is only £50ish then I think it's a steal! I would have happily paid a lot more (But don't tell Sony!) Before I discovered that Vegas can also be very useful I was seriously considering buying it just to get hold of the latest DVD Architect. (I'll come clean, in the end I reviewed it so I have a free NFR copy, on the other hand, I paid for CS2 and the upgrade to CS3 so, as you can imagine, I wasn't best pleased to discover it wouldn't work with ProCoder m2v files)

PS Provided you choose sensible data rates DVD-A definitely won't re-encode unless you want it to. One of my gripes about CS2/3 is that it is very difficult to discover exactly what it is re-encoding or why.

John, just did a bit of research. You can buy DVD-A Studio for less than £30 on the Sony site. What isn't clear to me is how Studio differs from the Pro version I have that comes with Vegas. It might be wise to make sure what the differences are. I'll have another look and see if I can find out.

I couldn't find a definitive answer. I'll start another thread and see if Z Cheema responds.

I've done some more research and there appear to be significant differences between the Studio version and the Pro version. I suggest you download the User Manuals and compare. Both are available here:

http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/download/manuals

I don't think Studio supports Chapter points and I suspect it's file handling is more limited. I also suspect it won't get the free upgrade to Blu-ray authoring, at least not immediately. There are other differences.

Ah well, you get owt for nowt! The full Pro version is still a bargain bundled with Vegas.

A quick look at comparing the Pro. and Studio versions, show they both import m2v files and burn with AC3 audio. Pro. has more import file options, and burns to a master.
Which ever way you look at it, Pro. isn`t going to break the bank providing I can get my head round the way it works. I have just downloaded the latest version.
Thanks for your help.

John, I'm not pretending to be an expert in DVD-A, Z Cheema and others are much more experienced than me but, if we can help, then just shout.

Thanks for the offer. I'll give it time, as I have a holiday shortly and may wait before I jump in with both feet.
I have the Pro 4.5b trial to play with now.

In the Check Project box in Encore i got the "Project exceeds disc capacity" warning.
The first thing I thought that the bitrate was too high, I must have entered the wrong bitrate into PC3 so I encoded again, and again got the same "project exceeds disc capacity" message in Encore CS3
I thought I would go ahead and burn the DVD anyway. Away it went, gave another are you sure message, i continued and the project burnt to disc ok, well it played as normal in my DVD player, I can see nothing wrong with it.

Would Encore CS3 give wrong warning messages?

Tony

I gave it another shot on a different project/different encoded file and again the DVD wont start after 15 seconds.

I made another project with a few animated buttons and after the 15 second the DVD did start to play. I cant figure this out.

Tony

Tony,
Harry and I were on at the beginning of the thread, so I've been glancing at it.
I was trying to figure out your work flow and I was wondering if you could help me out.

Do you have a main menu with 2 buttons (Play All and Scenes)?

Is the main menu set as "first play".

What a lot of folks do is just import the .avi from Premiere into Encore and let Encore do the encoding.
Also, frequentlly they will create a DVD folder, and then burn it to the harddrive and then use something like PowerDVD to play the folder and see if there are any problems, which saves burning a DVD. I never got in the habit of using DVD-RW disks, but that's another possibility.
Finallly, I've noticed that frequentlly ImgBurn is used to actually burn the disk (including me).
This tutorial (Random Menus) at the bottom of the list may apply.
http://jmrser.com/Tutorials.html
John

John, The DVD that wont start after the first 15seconds just has one play button and MMenu set @ first play.

The DVD that starts after 15 seconds has 5/6 animated buttons (chapters) and one play button and also has mmenu @ first play.

I created an ISO file from encore for the one that didn't start after 15sec thinking that it might make a difference and burning with nero, but it didn't.

Its no big problem if it doesn't play after the given time, Just hit the play button and away it goes, just curious why it wont work, when in the preview window it will work/play after 15 seconds.

Thanks for that bit of info too.

Tony

Another different project and again getting the "Project exceeds disc capacity" warning message again.
Am I doing something wrong?.

Tony

Hi Tony,
What's the duration of this one - you've crossed check bit rate as before presumably - what is it?
Haven't got my software open, but from memory the DVD media window is changeable - mine is probably on default of DVD 4.7gig (I'm on CS2) - check it's not marked for custom dvd size or set to CD.
Also, you can burn to hard drive, where it may behave different and you can check post burn what the folder size is - hopefully <4.7gig.
HTH

Hi Dave, Thanks, Wedding project 2hrs. 09mins and yes bitrate fine.
Avg..4512 Min.. 2704 Max..7896
Had a look and its set at Size 4.7 GB

Only used Encore 4/5 times, first 2/3 times no problem with size before, just these last two projects (see above post)

I don't know were I'm going wrong.

Another question, What do you normanly do at output, Burn DVD Disc, Folder, image or Master.

Tony

Hi Tony,
I use similar bit rate, but prefer not to go over 105 mins and use 2nd DVD if it's over - unless it's a high volume(100's) job -though I know many forum users often use 2hrs plus on a dvd though assume it's at a lower bit rate.
So it possibly is too big - or is the last straw compared to previous.. or previous have contained a parameter somewhere that reduces quality/bit-rate to fit DVD?

I also like to leave a margin on DVD so it's not burning to very edge.
Personally I burn to HD folder as this can be played from 'powerdvd' to remind yourself of contents at a later date and check encoding is ok (which you can't do with iso).
This also means a common source of reference.
If your physical DVD is your master, then post to client, then need to re-create a new master etc.

HTH

Dave thanks. I don't think its too big, could be wrong, 2hrs 15 was one i did a few back and didn't get the no room error. I use PC3 2 pass, Master quality.

I burnt to disc ignoring the warning messages (like I did a few post back) and as far as i see it plays ok in my DVD Player.

Strange.

thanks for the advice too BTW.

Tony

Surely a file of 4.7 GB is too big, even if it includes audio. 4.3 GB is the absolute limit for file size. I do not exceed 4.0 GB as a rule.

As before, the same encoded file that encore said was to big, burnt to DVD in DVDLab with no problems.
Strange.

BTW my file isnt 4.7

Tony

I still think you're pushing your luck size wise - you've been lucky in the past.
Is it possible the DVD lab was used for encoding as well as burn, so it would lower bit rate in it's own software?
Or if it was just taling the encoded folder fom HD and copying to DVD is it possible it finished without burning the last few minutes?
Out of ideas.. time for tea.

Hope you enjoyed your tea :)

I know, its a strange one.

No, its the same encoded file the encore didn't like that DVDLab burnt. Encoded with PC3 Master Q. and 2 pass

I have always used a bitrate calculator recommended by Anton from the grassvalley forums and its never let me down.

According to properties my file size is 4.33gb

Anyway, as I said before, I just ignored the warning messages that Encore gave and it burnt to disc and plays fine. (right to the very end)

Thanks all.

Tony

For my project my bitrate settings are...
Wedding project 2hrs. 09mins
Avg..4512
Min.. 2704
Max..7896

Tell me what settings you would use just to compare to mine.

Tony

I use similar rates with 2 pass vbr.
Your average could be less in practice if say have a locked off camera and figure speaking to camera standing in front of static b/g, or plain wall. e.g. speaches.

I just had a look back at another project that was 2hrs 16 mins long, It gave no error messages about disc space and yet this one at 9 mins shorter did. :(

Right, Could I ask this, Encore says this wont fit onto a DVD disc, I ignored the warning messages and burn to disc. It worked and plays in my DVD player perfectly.

Is there something wrong with this DVD I don't see, Is it safe to give to the Bride & groom.

Tony

Probably.
Do you get the message if you burn to a HD folder?
Regardless, as I mentioned before, burn to folder on HD, then copy to DVD using data verification tick box and finally check dvd file size is exactly the same as folder, if it is it should be OK.. but as i said, i prefer to leave a margin than burn to edge of DVD. For 20p why not stick it o 2 DVD's - using say speaches as natural break point. You acn get double DVd case for single 'package' delivery.
I've probably added to indecision rather than aided..

HI, set it to HD Folder (275gb free space) and still getting the same message, so somethings wrong somewhere.

Your right, I know 2 dvds would give better pictures, but at 2hrs.09 its not overly long and with master Q, 2 pass, the picture quality isn't bad. I just thinks its best to have it on one DVD.

Having said that, i have put weddings on two DVDs for B&Gs before when the project went over 2hrs 30 mins.
Just double the work for 2 dvds too BTW.

Update: Had another look at the project that said it wont fit disc. I tranccoded the AC3 audio file (went for auto) and then went to check project and found no errors this time.

Another question: Is it ok to transcode the AC3 audio file with encore.

Again, burnt to disc and it played 100%

Tony

Hi Tony,
I have nothing to contribute on AC3, maybe someone else can comment.

Thanks Dave, no problem.

Tony